We just got some new-old-stock Sugino PX crankarms. These had been hiding in a corner of Sugino's warehouse for many years. When we asked Sugino about making more, they told us the molds had been discarded, but there were still a couple of cases of 175mm arms around.
The Sugino PX was Sugino's version of the TA Cyclotouriste, or Pro-5-Vis crank. Like the TA it uses the great 50.4mm BCD. That means you can use all the TA chainrings, from 26t to 62t. It can be set up as a single, double, triple, or even as a quad. Unlike the TA, there is plenty of room between the arm and the outer chainring so you can use all the modern derailleurs with "shaped" outer cages and it's much easier to fit chain guard and chain cases.
Best of all, the PX arms cost $145, versus $235 for the TA crankarms. 175mm only, JIS spindles (115-118mm for doubles and 120-121mm for triples. Regular British pedal threading.
Also, we have double chain ring bolts for TA or PX cranks again.
UPDATE: I think the q-factor for a double PX is closer to 148-150mm
How many pairs do you have? Any chance you can limit the number purchased to discourage hoarders?
ReplyDeleteNice to see such a cool product unearthed from a dusty corner. A year ago I woulda been in the market. As it is, I hope you can offer a VO crank that takes advantage of that BCD while improving the design with modern hardware and a reasonable price.
ReplyDeleteFor those considering such cranks, a 115mm spindle was too short on my P5V cranks. The chain rubs the crank arm in the 9th cog and big ring...
that's funny. I still have a set that was OEM spec on a crappy 80's mountain bike. The Sugino rings are soft metal that wears out quickly.
ReplyDeleteI was about to post the question, 'Why buy these when the Nervar arms look better and come in more sizes?' Fortunately, I took a look and saw they are all gone. Lucky I snapped up a pair.
ReplyDeleteAnd do not worry 'C' I am using the Nervar. Used them to replace a still very good looking Campy NR set that is now in my trophy case.
Chris - you come through again - thanks.
ReplyDeleteI'd love to have a set of those. If they were 170mm, I'd be $145 poorer right now.
ReplyDeleteIs Sugino the sort of company who will build new molds? I still wish they would reissue the Specialized 'flag' cranks, minus the crack-prone webbing.
ReplyDeletemb
i don't understand why anyone buys the pricey ta or sugino px cranks/rings. why don't you get sugino to do a 110/74 triple that is made for their cheap and readily available flat rings in that size? (the ramped/pinned rings on their current offerings are not available as replacments!?) E.g., a remade AT. As Sheldon sez,
ReplyDeleteThe Sugino AT was the first to use the 110 mm/74 mm bolt circle, and was possibly the finest triple crank ever.
Why use a TA or PX:
ReplyDeleteBecause your buddies dont have one.
Because you like a low Q factor
Because you want an elegant wide range double.
Because it's a chunk of history
Because they are light weight
Because you can run any ring combo you want.
But mainly, because your buddies dont have one.
Exactly, pure vanity. You can keep 'em.
ReplyDeleteSome of you don't get it. With todays 9 and 10 speed cassettes most folks do not need triples. With a crank like this you can run 48/30 or 46/30 rings (as I do) and handle any reasonable terrain. You can slog up mountains with 30-28 and pedal down hills in 48-12. The advantages include a lower q-factor, less weighs, simpler and less frequent shifting, a simpler drive line, better chain-line, and the priceless feeling that you're smarter than the average bear ;<)
ReplyDeleteThere is also a certain elegance in having eliminated a bunch of gearing combinations that you'll almost never use.
vanity? um. could we explain that? i have at least 5 pairs of sugino cranks, a pair of white industries cranks, cook bros RCRs, Nervars, Record Track, and so on. My most comfortable cranks to spin with are my TAs. Next are my Nervars. Next are my SR Apex Touring Cranks. Is it coincidence that these cranks allow a super low q factor? Probally not.
ReplyDelete"Exactly, pure vanity. You can keep 'em."
ReplyDeleteLow q-factor. If you don't want it or understand it, fine. But it is ridiculous to dismiss it as pure vanity. One of my bikes came with a Sugino Triple.
The triple is on some e-bayer's bike some where. I am perfectly happy with the low q-factor and lighter weight of my double TA that replaced it.
As mentioned above, the reason people shell out big bucks for the admittedly lovely White is also the low q-factor. Picking up an nos Nervar or now a PX here at VO is a real deal if this is what you like in a bike.
If it has more room between the crank arm and the outer chainring, does it also have a larger Q?
ReplyDeleteyes it does. the forging is also thicker than the TA. maybe 5-7mm wider.
ReplyDeletethanx all for the info on the benefits of the TA & PX, but i mostly ride in my inner 42 double ring or middle 38 triple ring. how am i going to get a reasonably straight chain line riding with a 48/30 or 46/30 double? i'm more of a spinner than a masher.
ReplyDeletefirst: chainlines are crucial when you have an inflexible chain, like a bushing chain, or a 1/8inch track chain. think about your chainline though, with a semi normal 38/52 front ring combo. when is it perfect? in one out of 7-11 gears. that's it. so normally you're running a less than perfect chainline, anyway. The narrowness of the TA-esque crank allows you to run your outer ring in basically the same position as your middle ring. I can use all of my rear cogs with my 46, and not put undue stress on the chain. similarly, when i bail to my 26 tooth, if I keep my chain on the easier cogs, everything is OK. I rarely stand on my bike, and the set up works fine for me. Standing is for singlespeeds, which, while fine, are not the subject at hand.
ReplyDelete"With today's 9 and 10 speed cassettes most folks do not need triples."
ReplyDeleteAgree.
..and some of us favor 50/34 rings with 11-26 cassettes with which we can ascend to our hearts content.
Will these really work correctly on modern 10-speed rigs? The chain is much narrower, and at least with a Campagnolo setup, an older 8-speed crank isn't said to work very well with a 10-speed setup. I thought the chainrings were spaced too far apart and that there was a practical risk of losing the chain in between the rings. Not so?
ReplyDeletei'm guessing there's another significant benefit to the PX crank versus the TA:
ReplyDeletei dont know for sure, but the PX probably uses the "standard" crank threads, no?
The reason you use a triple chainring is to have as least possible deviation from a the straight chainline. It's common sense. You do not use a triple crank to have more gears! Having a lower Q-Factor does not give you access to more gears to use at the rear setup without distorting your chainline. TA cranksets are best used with the lowest number of rear cogs, keep it to 3 maximum per front chainring.
ReplyDeleteWith modern flexible chains, chain line is not nearly as important as it was in the old days. You can use a single chain ring with 9 or 10 cogs.
ReplyDeleteHello Chris,
ReplyDeleteI just signed up for the Everest Challenge out of Bishop CA How do I get a hold of a 48 30 or 46 28 crankset to fit on my 2006 Scattante CFR comp all carbon(PerformanceBikes)which currently has a compact 50 34, 68mm bottom bracket size, 175mm Crank length. External. I'm running Dura Ace cassette 10 speed up to a 27 (don't know the little one). I love to climb and am not much into going fast on straightaways. Thanks much, John
Do you have any information on the chainring screws or where can I find them? Thanks!
ReplyDelete@ Tom
ReplyDeleteI think our 50.4 crank bolts should fit the Sugino PX crank.
Scott @ VO