tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post7642296815737550563..comments2024-03-18T10:19:55.782-04:00Comments on The Velo ORANGE Blog: More on New Rims and WheelsVelo Orangehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02835615331417822722noreply@blogger.comBlogger44125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-75740407613711461952009-08-13T13:30:32.641-04:002009-08-13T13:30:32.641-04:00Bummer. C'est la vie, I guess. Vive la differe...Bummer. C'est la vie, I guess. Vive la difference, er, traditional terminology, er, curmudgeonly stuff.....<br /><br />OK. That's different. Never mind. (as in: Emily Litella).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-5475182247316335832009-08-13T13:05:33.563-04:002009-08-13T13:05:33.563-04:00In much of Asia the term for developing almost any...In much of Asia the term for developing almost any tooling is "opening a mold". It can be a CNC operation, but you still "open a mold" and pay the "mold cost" when developing a new product.Velo Orangehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02835615331417822722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-79336919995485445852009-08-13T12:56:59.099-04:002009-08-13T12:56:59.099-04:00A minor quibble, but folks often talk about 'm...A minor quibble, but folks often talk about 'molds' for things like hub bodies. Do you mean forging dies? As a nerd Engineer, it is like hearing fingernails screech on a blackboard (to my geeky self, anyways) when I hear about 'molds' for forgings. Can we call them forging dies, pretty-please, avec une cerise au-dessus? :-)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-16986890295107672562009-07-22T09:45:21.510-04:002009-07-22T09:45:21.510-04:00The ERD of our 700c rims are 606mm.
I weighed a f...The ERD of our 700c rims are 606mm. <br />I weighed a few rims and they are all around 450g.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01015305191743399671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-58313861230017380442009-07-11T09:54:48.884-04:002009-07-11T09:54:48.884-04:00I've never owned a pair, but to my eye the sup...I've never owned a pair, but to my eye the super high flange hubs that Herse and some others retro-fitted were the last word in cool. I can't imagine they're more or less comfortable than any other hub. <br /><br />(That being said, what was actually the point of said high flanges? Did it make the wheel stiffer? If so, how come the modern high-end racing hubs are all low-flange? Just curious.)Dadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09016373487910801383noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-89125672266782215872009-07-11T09:21:43.315-04:002009-07-11T09:21:43.315-04:00Actually, I am sure that the Miche hubs are Italia...Actually, I am sure that the Miche hubs are Italian made. Remember that they really are no more expensive than Veloce/Mirage hubs used to be. They are also the hubs that the confrerie de 650b specs for it's bikes. Here is a link to the UK distributor....<br />http://chickencycles.co.uk/index.php?cat=40&sub=102&ord=2<br /><br />Miche doesn't just make track hubs :)Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00717985757587396709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-45606681611976046902009-07-10T23:48:25.689-04:002009-07-10T23:48:25.689-04:00As far as hubs go, why not drill in Maxi-car style...As far as hubs go, why not drill in Maxi-car style keyholes on the driveside. <br /><br />Also and on a separate unrelated topic, why not make an adapter spider for TA-style cranks, that fits 110 bcd cranks. The idea being that the spider will be in the same position as the outer ring of a 50.4bcd crankset. From what I see, the selection for outer chainrings is rather limited, and quite expensive. So as to promote this very small bcd, promote the idea that different spiders for different bcds, oddball combinations, ect. can be used with the same crank, all with a very simple to change spider, nothing fancy, just bolts.Anon of Floridanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-91648079436792206492009-07-10T17:29:42.969-04:002009-07-10T17:29:42.969-04:00Would it be possible to make a VO hubset based off...Would it be possible to make a VO hubset based off of the castings for the Shimano 105-5500? Those are the ones without the OS axle/body, and are far better looking than the 5600, imho. <br /><br />Having the hub body significantly larger in diameter than the fork end tubing diameter is poor proportions contributing to poor esthetics. I'm not saying the current 105 hubs are hideous, but they look out of place on a lightweight steel frame. The proportion of hub body diameter to fork tubing, and the radius of the fillet leading into the flange are the two important esthetic issues. <br /><br />Retaining the look of a vintage hub is more important to me than the possible added stiffness of an OS body/axle. Wouldn't offering a standard body, nicely filleted hub be a significant market differentiator for VO?sarennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-11386900980338162612009-07-10T16:02:59.888-04:002009-07-10T16:02:59.888-04:00I call the GB singlewall rims 'open box' r...I call the GB singlewall rims 'open box' rims, as that's what they resemble.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01015305191743399671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-33002840024254728242009-07-10T13:36:05.040-04:002009-07-10T13:36:05.040-04:00The Grand Bois rim is not a double box section rim...The Grand Bois rim is not a double box section rim. If I had to choose I would take the CR18 over the GB.ChrisCullumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645176987387516756noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-39073701739155582852009-07-10T03:10:58.686-04:002009-07-10T03:10:58.686-04:00The new 650b rim sounds great, it will be nice to ...The new 650b rim sounds great, it will be nice to have another 650b rim alternative. I would like to clarify a few things, Industry9 hubs are made right here in N.C. USA. That Miche hubs are really made in Italy. The Miche track hubs are probably the best deal going. They cost $10 more than surly, and the tall flanges look great on a retro build with the stickers removed. Any chance for a light weight 650b rim made for narrower tires?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-56690018447988507932009-07-10T02:29:33.694-04:002009-07-10T02:29:33.694-04:00What Chris Cullum is saying about the cassette hub...What Chris Cullum is saying about the cassette hub is, in my opinion, right on. By using a shorter free hub that allows for less sprockets from a cassette, you can respace the rest of the hub to allow for much better dish. A seven gear cassette is also much easier to shift than a nine speed, though I have found the eight speed cassette not too bad (friction shifters).<br /><br />The only thing holding me back from the Phil freewheel hub at this point is the price.<br /><br />If Velo-Orange can fill this niche, I say go for it. Otherwise I concur we don't need something that Shimano is already providing in the 105 or Deore.<br /><br />Btw, I was really floored to see a two-speed freewheel is being made. I was thinking about such a thing and lo and hold, there it is!Garthnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-1025545797896788432009-07-10T00:03:05.197-04:002009-07-10T00:03:05.197-04:00I would like to see a nice classic looking hub for...I would like to see a nice classic looking hub for campagnolo now when campagnolo has stoped making polished hubs , there are so many options already for shimanoAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-34126536689603253532009-07-09T18:47:49.971-04:002009-07-09T18:47:49.971-04:00great that you will be selling 20mm 700 rims , I h...great that you will be selling 20mm 700 rims , I have been waiting a long time for this now I can replace my old 70's , Grand Bois already make the wider 23mm rimAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-48688157784794018312009-07-09T14:49:03.643-04:002009-07-09T14:49:03.643-04:00Butted spokes would add about $50-60 to the cost o...Butted spokes would add about $50-60 to the cost of the wheel. A CR-18 is a fabulous rim in 27x1 1/4" It's really the best ever 27" rim made.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01015305191743399671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-79001620330747402732009-07-09T12:57:34.722-04:002009-07-09T12:57:34.722-04:00Okay now that there's a 650B rim, you need som...Okay now that there's a 650B rim, you need some nice 650B tires. Will you be selling Kirk Pacenti's new Pari Moto?giant hogweedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13043709046596769145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-44577307511963767032009-07-09T12:28:32.606-04:002009-07-09T12:28:32.606-04:00Is there a reason for not using butted spokes? My...Is there a reason for not using butted spokes? My understanding is that they are lighter and that the added flexibility actually makes them more durable.<br /><br />also, I was going to mention my interest in 27 inch rims, but I guess that the cr18 is really about as good as it gets. Look a little clunky on a lightweight though.thechammphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00636406459402950666noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-81564155635934614432009-07-09T12:10:20.910-04:002009-07-09T12:10:20.910-04:00The cassette hub is an interesting idea. If you...The cassette hub is an interesting idea. If you're worried about whether this is already adequately covered, how about a 7spd width cassette body? This would be unique, result in less wheel dish, allow one to use modern shifters by using 8 of a 9 speed cassette cluster or old school by just using a 7 speed cassette (which is less finicky for friction shifting). Both types of cassettes are still readily available. I know this can be done by transplanting a 7spd body on a 8-9-10 speed hub but that requires digging thru parts bins, ebay, NOS, etc. That could be a good niche to fill.ChrisCullumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645176987387516756noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-48482966145812091902009-07-09T11:56:13.768-04:002009-07-09T11:56:13.768-04:00I would have liked to see the 700C rim in around t...I would have liked to see the 700C rim in around the 22-23mm width range to better go with the 28-32mm tires that are popular with this crowd. In terms of rims there is a lot of 19-20mm wide road rims and then there's wider, heavy touring rims, not much in between other than the Velocity Synergy and CR18 (which is a bit utilitarian for a nice bike). Can you say who is going to make the rims?ChrisCullumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645176987387516756noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-31116969250176329192009-07-09T10:58:53.079-04:002009-07-09T10:58:53.079-04:00I'm looking at the Miche hubs in the QBP catal...I'm looking at the Miche hubs in the QBP catalogue. I'd be very surprised if they were actually made in Italy, especially for what they are selling for as a set. Busy graphics, red anodized dust covers and a cheapo quick release make me think it's Taichung, not Milano. There's nothing wrong with where it's made- American Classic, WTB, Surly, DMR, Industry9, Sturmey Archer, and many many other brands have their hubs made in Taiwan often with better quality than when they were made domestically. The Miche hubs are priced where these brands are; EU and US made hubs are hundreds more. <br /><br />I see road hubs made by Phil, Campag, King, DT, and Shimano. Those are the Big Guys. There are a many smaller players: American Classic, Sun Ringle, and brands such as Dimension, Surly, Soma, etc. Do we really want to defend sales in this area, with a hub that is largely similar? We could play the snazzy graphics game, but that's not our bag. With the exception of Phil, none of these brands- big or small, are interested in selling just hubs. They are all seeing big sales pre built wheel. Our own sales of hubs and rims vs complete wheels point us in that direction too. DIY wheelbuilding, while romantic, is a shrinking market.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01015305191743399671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-79109767969405700032009-07-09T10:43:24.456-04:002009-07-09T10:43:24.456-04:00If we did hubs they would be low flange or hi-low,...If we did hubs they would be low flange or hi-low, sealed bearing, with VO QRs. <br /><br />The way I would do it is to use an existing hub shell and then spec the bearings, cassette body, axle, and finish we wanted. The hub body is the expensive part, but there are dozens and dozens of molds for them already floating around. That would give most of what we want without a huge investment.<br /><br />By the way, I remember that I very happy to get low flange hubs after racing and touring on high flange for years. The low flange hubs were lighter and more comfortable.Velo Orangehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02835615331417822722noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-50140501357285107172009-07-09T10:05:05.893-04:002009-07-09T10:05:05.893-04:00I checked out the Grand Bois website. They sell a ...I checked out the Grand Bois website. They sell a cassette hub. 7/8/9/10 speed compatible, Shimano spline, sealed bearing. For the $135ish price, it probably has a steel cassette and 3 sealed bearings. not too bad for the money. It's made by Joytech. Low flange. External quick release. Eh. <br /><br />The hubs VO was looking at were hi/lo flange hubs, 4 sealed bearings, shimano splined, alloy cassette body. It would have the same OS hubshell like 105/ultegra. It would sell for about $150.<br /> <br />A 105 hubset (looseball, not top of the line, but still good quality and utility) sells for $110 a pair. And you all can probably find them for less, in 10 different websites. <br /><br />Having a hubset made to our spec: high flange, cassette (or freewheel for that matter) sealed bearing (or loose ball) cromoly axle, our QR, would require us to open tooling, probably $6-10,000. The factories will gladly take our money for tooling and production but they expect purchases of 1,000-10,000 hubs annually for it to make sense for them.<br /><br />There's not much motivation for us to do the research, hacking and tinkering, finance the tooling and commit to thousands of units annually when the sales will just not match what we have to buy, especially based on the price we would have to sell it for. We are still a tiny niche of a market in the big picture. And we are fickle; we can't come to a consensus on what we want: looseball or sealed bearing? Thread on or cassette hub? Solid or QR axle?Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01015305191743399671noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-11990632880445765502009-07-09T09:50:04.726-04:002009-07-09T09:50:04.726-04:00When you have the rims it might be helpful to post...When you have the rims it might be helpful to post the ERD for those who want to build their own wheels up. Makes it easier to get the correct spoke length. <br /><br />Flange dimensions, too, if you have hubs made...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-68857445255077942982009-07-09T09:44:05.207-04:002009-07-09T09:44:05.207-04:00The old Miche hubs were junk. Maybe these are bett...The old Miche hubs were junk. Maybe these are better?<br /><br />High flange hubs are for building stiffer wheels which is good for track racing, but not for comfort.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-24415034.post-36781184788848312432009-07-09T08:22:15.214-04:002009-07-09T08:22:15.214-04:00Great sealed bearing hub set = Miche Racing hubs, ...Great sealed bearing hub set = Miche Racing hubs, now from QBP or available from the UK.<br /><br />Lightweight 17c rim = DRC ST19. DRC also makes a nice "classic" rim too, all made in Milan.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00717985757587396709noreply@blogger.com